We are all former students at Lakenheath High School and other public schools in East Anglia. We were in school in the 70s and 80s and drank deeply from the well of British culture of those decades - the pints, the telly, and of course the footie!
Well, Johnny Mac has decided to show up after all, so I suppose we do have a debate on offer tonight. I'm having a few friends over, the drinks are on ice and I hope you'll join me to on the LOB tonight for a bit of political chat.
posted by The Blue Devil @ 7:41 PM
We are all former students at Lakenheath High School and other public schools in East Anglia. We were in school in the 70s and 80s and drank deeply from the well of British culture of those decades - the pints, the telly, and of course the footie!
73 Comments:
Our newest blog member Bivalve88 has suggested the following drinking game to make the rhetoric go down more easily tonight:
TAKE A SHOT:
-When the buzzwords “change” or “maverick” or “hope” are used
-When someone says “I voted for or against” or “He voted for or against”
-When McCain refers to Obama’s “inexperience”
-When McCain stammers and looks like he might have a heart attack
-When McCain somehow works in his personal story as a POW during Vietnam
-When McCain refers to the moderator as “my friend” or the audience as “my friends”
-When Obama somehow works in his personal story of being raised by a single mom and his grandparents
-When Obama makes a smirk, shakes his head, and says, “Now wait just a minute…” or “hold on there…”
-When Obama makes the case that McCain and Bush are one and the same or uses the phrase “more of the same”
-When Obama talks about “multi-tasking” or having to address more than one crisis at a time as president
-When anyone brings up “suspending the campaign”
-When either one lays claims to being “bipartisan” or working “across the aisle”
-It’s a Social when Sarah Palin is mentioned!
-Finish whatever you are drinking if McCain loses his temper!
ECONOMY SPECIFIC RULES:
TAKE A SHOT:
-When someone mentions the “Bailout” of Wall Street
-When someone mentions Wall Street and Main Street in the same train of thought
-When someone starts quoting dollar figures (for example: 700 billion)
-When someone talks about mortgages/foreclosures/homeowners
FOREIGN POLICY SPECIFIC RULES:
TAKE A SHOT:
-If anyone uses the words “surge” or “victory”
-When anyone mentions a particular nation as being a potential “nuclear” threat
-When McCain talks about Islamic Radicals/Terrorists
-When Georgia and/or Russia are mentioned
-When Iran and/or Iraq are mentioned
-When Afghanistan is mentioned
-It’s a social for al Qaeda or North Korea!
-Finish whatever you are drinking if anyone delivers specifics on how to get out of Iraq “safely and responsibly”.
Looks like Jim Lehrer is out on stage pumping up the crowd at Ole Miss.
Here we go!
First question starts with a quote from Ike Eisenhower - oi!
And of course it's about the bail-out.
Barack's playing it safe by tipping toward the Paulson plan with a few caveats. That pins McCain into a corner. Will he come out against?
Good strong critique of deregulation and trickle-down politics. Zowie!
Nice touch from John McCain, sending a message out about Ted Kennedy. McCain is trying desperately to strike an informal tone that's appealing. It's all he's got with the issues against him.
Lehrer follows up well by trying to pin the two down on the Paulson plan on the table. Obama waffles by saying that he hasn't seen the plan yet. That's the wrong tack. Come on, Barack. It's three pages. Jeez!
And now John McCain says that "he hopes" that he'll be able to vote for the plan. More waffling. All we need is some syrup and powdered sugar.
Barack really needs to pull up a direct from McCain extolling the virtues of deregulation. Things are a bit stiff, despite Lehrer's efforts to get them to talk to each other.
Asked McCain what he'd do in office, he trots out the standard "let's control spending." Now he's thumping earmarks. Surely Barack can beat him up on his history of earmarking.
McCain now goes after Barack on the issue of earmarks. Can anyone say Iraq War spending?
Great! Obama goes after McCain on tax cuts for the rich. Way to go, Barack. McCain's looking edgy here.
This is excellent. Barack's heading McCain off on the tax hike issue.
Boy, I wish Barack would hit McCain on the Iraq War. How on earth can McCain talk about controlling spending when he wants to continue the occupation in Iraq?
Excellent! Obama addresses the issue of tax loopholes to destroy McCain's specious argument about "high business" (read: corporate) taxes. And he's going after market mythology. Good stuff.
Just got home from work.
Billy was a lot smoother than BO.
Lots of shots from Johnny on the $932M.
AZ Kicker
I'm begging for Obama to bring up the Keating Five here. He's got to go for the jugular.
Hey, Steve. Are you having trouble signing on to the blog?
My wife think BO is using Cue cards. Is this allowed?
AZ
PS - can't remember my password
Keating ? BO was in diapers at the time. Old history. As your buddy Teddy would say, water under the bridge.
AZ
McCain's weakness on this spending issue is that the largest expenditure is the Iraq War, which McCain has almost single-handedly promoted. I just don't think that conservatives look at the GOP as a small government party anymore after eight years of Bush.
I'll send you another invitation message so that you can go through the set-up again. Good to have you on board. Btw, Keating was in the 80s when BO was in his thirties and cuts directly against the kind of narrative that McCain is spinning about corruption.
I have never confused the GOP with conservatives.
Go gridlock. it is our only hope.
AZ
Now, there I agree with you, mate! I wish there were more gridlock on educational issues. The only thing that's saved social studies education is the lack of national history standards.
I'll assume that you'll be supporting Bob Barr, then. Good man!
Agreed 25 years ago. OB was still in college?? btw McCain was totally exonarated (at least in the AZ press).
it will not play any more than teddy and MJK.
AZ
McCain's "got plans" for reducing the budget. I'll bet.
Bob Barr?
How would me voting for Bob Barr lead to gridlock?
AZ
Yes! Barack's finally swinging on the issue of eight years of Bush. Whew!
Bob's all about gridlock, baby!
I've just sent you another invitation, mate. Whack a picture up on your profile while you're at it.
Good, now Barack's tying the Iraq issue in with the economy. Excellent response. Really striking at McCain's vulnerabilities. He's mentioned Bush's name with McCain's about six times now. Keep it up!
Got the invite. But ended in an endless loop with accounts and passwords. Well try later.
AZ
Barack's getting feisty now!
Sorry, mate. I wish it were easier.
McCain seems hesitant to talk about Afghanistan. He's stuck on "the surge." Good line from Obama about how McCain likes to pretend that Iraq started in 2007.
Here's where I part company with Obama. The last thing we need is more troops in Afghanistan. Where's the anti-war candidate that I'm looking for?
Johnny is taking credit on his role in Iraq - the surge. In a sense, the start of his influence.
BO is now pushing for his role in Afghanistan - a surge. Hmmmm. Jealous?
This is playing well for Johnny (outside of academia).
Nice whitewashing of the history of Afghanistan by McCain, neatly avoiding the fact that Reagan funded and trained the guys who became the Taliban and Al Qaeda in the 80s.
Our comments crossed about the surge. BO is outside his message.
The McCain surge sealed his nomination. Will it carry the election? It does play well with ten's of millions of voters.
I'm not sure. McCain at this point needs a knock-out punch and I'd call this a draw. Obama's merely trying to play it safe and the issues will take care of themselves. If the election were held today, Obama would win by about twenty electoral votes. It's his to lose and McCain's to try to win at this point.
With the economy the main focus of the election, McCain loses. The only issue that he's got is "The Surge," and that only plays with the base of the GOP, not with swing voters.
I wish Obama were outside his message when talking about surging in Afghanistan but unfortunately that's been his and the Dems' consistent message for years now. You may remember that Kerry played that "we took our eye off the real enemy" tack four years ago against Bush.
Obama really needs to hit McCain on exactly what victory in Iraq means. He needs him to specify what he means by that, instead of just allowing him to use it as a rhetorical device.
We will see in the blobs in couple of hours. My wife, who has never back Johnny, thinks JM is cleaning up.
Zogby has some interesting comments on the race.
http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20080925/NEWS01/80925009/1002/NEWS
Again with the "defeat" and "victory" in Iraq. McCain's as repetitive as Rudy Giuliani on 9/11.
80% of America is bored with this debate. These people also think Iran, Iraq, and Afghanistan are states of the same country.
Finally, let's talk energy. $4 gas will get thier attention back.
I haven't bought anything that Zogby has said since he predicted a Kerry landslide four years ago. I don't expect a landslide this year mainly because of the issue of race. I think there's a significant "Bradley effect" in the polling right now. It'll be a narrow win for Obama.
Let me predict McCain's pitch:
"Drill, baby, drill!"
their, there, they're
Blobs lead to typo's
Oh well. now I am getting bored with these guys.
Should we really elect someone who can't pronounce the name of a head of state?
I agree - the debates really should be just an hour. They always run out of steam at this point.
Again McCain is painting himself into a corner by backing the Bush policy of non-negotiation. He needs to peel off from the Bush legacy at some point.
Race? in what way? You think BO will win ONLY because he is black?
JM is hoping he gets the same % of white voters that BO gets of black voters. That would be a landslide.
Nice! Now Obama is nailing McCain on that "senior moment" last week when he said that he wouldn't meet with Zapotera because he was a Latin American dictator.
Still bored. The foreign policy debate is held for 2 reasons. Academia and potential gaffes.
No, I think that Obama would win in a landslide this year if he weren't black. You seem to think that the GOP can win this year after eight years of war, spending and recession. This ain't your year. Just wait until 2012. Obama's going to be neck-deep in the crap left over from Bush and the country will probably be ready for another change then.
I wish this debate were pitched at academia. Unfortunately recent research has showed that these debates are held on an eighth grade level with buzz phrases and rhetoric.
Actually I think this section of the debate has been one of the more effective ones, in which the differences are stark: negotiation vs. pre-emptive war. That's the choice. Again, the Bush doctrine appeals to about 30% (the GOP base) but has no appeal at all outside of that.
McCain doesn't want to go back to the Cold War. He wants a "hot war" with Russia!
Unfortunately, Obama is pro-nuke. Yikes! One more reason to vote for Nader.
BO is pretty consistent: run against 43. Ignore Johnny Boy. Ingore any discussion of his accomplishments. Hope the country doesn't care about his plans.
It may be 8th grade level, but the average person doesn't care. Talk about $4gas.
Recently, I had a discussion with a neighbor that never thinks about anything except getting through the day (kids, soccer practice, gas prices, etc).
Bailout? Ukraine? You've got to be kidding. These people vote on interesting things that can be summarized in 30 seconds. And there are 10's of millions of them. That is why tonight's debate is a big don't care unless a gaffe occurs.
That is why BO has a simple strategy ( or is this a tactic) - compare JM to 43. What the heck, maybe it will carry him to the White House. He will sh** bricks if he wins.
Still bored, AZ? Don't fret - this sucker is almost over. I've enjoyed our banter. I hope to hear from you on the weekends too. Liverpool are having a decent season and I'd love to see them capture a championship from the likes of Chelski and ManYoo.
BO is pro nuke only in campaign mode. No need to worry.
You're right - the main Obama strategy is running against Bush. And that will probably be enough to win this time around. He's not really a change guy, he's basically warmed over Clintonian neo-liberalism in an African-American package. You're also right that most voters are basically illiterate and need the issues spoon-fed in small bites.
I'm not worried because the nuke industry is basically moribund at this point. There's no way to do it safely. Everyone knows it and no one wants it in their backyard.
Star Wars was a major factor in bringing about the end of the Cold War? Hahahahahahahaha
I also agree that the loser is the guy who wins this year and has to inherit that unholy mess that the GOP has created over the past twenty five years. It's gonna be ugly.
Nothing new. and it was predicatable.
btw, I was not a fan of Johnny as an AZ senator. However, I have been intrigued with him as a president for a decade now. He is maybe my last hope of a president that did not toss around money to buy favor (yes even RR did this) and ran a super power in a way that would make Teddy R proud (talk softly and carry a big stick).
I'll try to join a football game or two.
go gridlock! keep gov out of my health care stop being a nanny state.
Cheerio, mate. Nice chatting with you!
now the pundits. Enjoy.
Well, it's all over. I call that one a draw, which as I mentioned before is a victory for Obama who is way up in the polls tonight and will continue to be so in the weeks that follow. This changes nothing for McCain who needed a big knock-out punch tonight and will hope he gets it from Sarah Palin next week.
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